Love growing cold … ? Pre-Trib/Post-Trib Issues

This is a follow up to the December 2015 Update edition of Be Alert article “Love growing cold … ? A Difficult Response To Paul Wilkinson.” Below moriel-ministries-videos Lifestyle C / Leefstyl C brother Al Dagger responds by trying to repair fellowship between all parties.

First, before going further let me respond to the few emails we received from those who thought Moriel was blatantly going after The Berean Call among other pre-trib ministries. This is not the case. Jacob and Moriel have always been able to teach along side pre-trib brethren and fellowships such as Calvary Chapel’s without letting this become an issue of division. It has rather been a few pre-trib ministries in particular since Dave Hunt and Chuck Smith have gone to be with the Lord that have decided for some reason that this must become an area of division between brothers. Please get your facts straight before writing to us about this matter. May I also recommend that you read Jacob’s book Harpazo, as it is the most “civil” and Scriptural book ever written on the subject of the resurrection and rapture of the church and does not once belittle or put down any other view but will leave you with a firm biblical foundation on the subject.

That said, on with the subject at hand.

Below is a letter from Al Dagger to all parties involved as well as a brief response from Jacob Prasch. I believe you will be refreshed by the honesty and biblical responses involved. From what I understand at this point Al Dagger tried by telephone to reason with the pre-trib parties named in this letter but the effort seemed fruitless.

May the Lord bless and keep you,
Scott Brisk

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Pre-Trib/Post-Trib Issues
Faithful are the wounds of a friend, …
– Proverbs 27:6a
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A Reply to Al Dagger from Jacob
Blessings in Jesus.I consider this to be a fair & accurate assessment by Brother Al and it is fairly comprehensive.

I would personally have no objections if Al wishes to print or web post it in the public domain inclusive of his critical observations of myself in certain specified regards, with which many would likely agree.

It is however unclear if Al realises that neither Joel or I were in involved in the production of “Left Behind or Led Astray” other than for no more than several minutes of contribution to the footage. We did not see the film until it’s release. I do however agree with Al’s remarks , but I find few objections to the film on the basis of its contents and I would defend its documented historical accuracy.

There are three issues I would like to briefly raise in response. First of all, Pre Wrath brethren believe that an angel is the restrainer , while I agree with Pre Trib Brethren that it is The Holy Spirit ; I simply do not equate the removal of The Restrainer with the Rapture (The Greek text simply states that “He will cease restraining”, it does not state that the restrainer will be taken away). Thus, while I agree with Pre Wrath brethren on the timing of the rapture etc., my Intra Seal position is not exactly the same and I cannot be said to speak for the Pre Wrath position. There are certain differences,

Secondly, TA Mc Mahon’s shocking presentation and endorsement of Thomas Ice on the radio interview in which Thos. Ice promotes the view that the Great Apostasy of 2 Thess. Chap. 2 is the rapture is at open odds with what Dave Hunt and most other Pre Trib advocates believed and believe about the apostasy . Likewise, Dave Hunt forwarded the later edition of CH Broadbent’s ‘The Pilgrim Church’ which was featured and promoted by TBC. CH Broadbent , who was Brethren from childhood, was highly critical in that book of the person and legacy of JN Darby, and that book is was endorsed strongly by Dave Hunt in his forward.

Most seriously of all however is the promulgation by TA Mc Mahon on radio and by Paul Wilkinson at the TBC conference that the Trinity is not found plainly taught in the New Testament and must be”extrapolated “.

This is a dangerous and false teaching straight from the pages of the JW Watchtower and the lies of the Neo Sabelian ‘ Jesus Only’ cult. As stated on the rebuttal video, John 14 and the Great Commission (where ‘Name’ is singular in the Greek text) clearly teach the Tri-unity of

The God – Head exegetically. TA Mc Mahon’s statements echoed by Paul Wilkinson are music to the ears of a Jehovah’s Witness. For what had been the foremost discernment ministry in the world with Dave Hunt to now be be reduced to a sounding board for such error that Dave Hunt never would have approved of is to say the least ,very distressing and indeed extremely sad.

I must be honest here. There has been a major shift away from the heritage of Dave Hunt at TBC once TA Mc Mahon got hold of it in a number of areas. I have cited only three instances , but there are others not germane to the PreTrib issue not relevant to the issue at hand.

  • When Waiter Martin went to be with The Lord , CRI should have been buried in the same grave with him because once Hank H. got hold of CRI, he dragged it away from what it had been and killed it. CRI died with Walter Martin.
  • When Martin Lloyd Jones went home to glory Westminister Chapel should have been buried in the same grave with him because once RT Kendall got hold of it he likewise dragged it away from what it had been and killed it. Westminister Chapel died with Martin Lloyd Jones.
  • When Chuck Smith went to be with Jesus, Calvary Chapel should have been buried in the same grave with him because once Brian Broderson got hold of it he dragged it away from what it had been and killed it. CC died with Chuck Smith.

Now, it is the same. Dave Hunt would have never approved of TBC promoting this ludicrous Thomas Ice/ Tim La Haye false teaching that even most Pre Trib brethren reject that the Great Apostasy = the Rapture on its broadcast opposing non pre Trib proponents. More seriously still, neither would Dave Hunt have ever echoed this dangerous and false JW teaching that the Trinity must my extrapolated because it is not literally taught in scripture.

Again, there are other issues I could state also but will not regarding the direction that TBC is now so quickly gravitating into. When Dave Hunt went to be with The Lord, it now crushingly seems that TBC should have been buried in the same grave with him also, because once TA Mc Mahon got hold of it he began dragging TBC away from the heritage of Dave Hunt and he is likewise killing it off. When Brother Dave Hunt died, The Berean Call in the same way died with him.

It is indeed a very painful and an utterly shameful trend to witness. It is not unique to TBC, yet TA Mc Mahon has very conspicuously placed TBC into the same ugly groove. If TBC had been kept as a ere mechanism to perpetuate the teachings of Dave Hunt now that he is with Jesus in the way that J. Vernon Mc Gee’s ministry functions – I could respect and even value that. But thus is not the case. With a deep grief I only wish I was wrong. Dave Hunt never said or gave place for TBC to engage in the promotion of such dangerous and heterodox deceptions.

When Dave Hunt was still with us TBC was one of God’s chief vehicles to alert the Body of Christ against deception. Now in marked departure from what Dave Hunt said and did, TA Mc Mahon has been demonically duped into pursuing an agenda that is transforming TBC into a vehicle for the dissemination of deception. The denial of a literal basis for the Trinity or against all solid exegetical , contextual, and Co-textual reasoning , defining the Great Falling Away as being the Rapture are hardly trivial or peripheral deceptions. This is a keenly marketed attempt to mislead and deceive even the discerning remnant who under Dave Hunt came to trust TBC as a beacon of truth that exposes error and deception.

This is akin to John Mac Arthur’s false teaching being amplified by Brannon House and Jimmy De Young that it will be possible to worship Satan , follow anti Christ, and accept the Mark of The Beast and still be saved ( an erroneous teaching that likely would have sent Dave Hunt into near despondency , but which the new TBC of TA Mc Mahon has to date conspicuously failed to challenge). The very ministries who once armed armed the discerning remnant are themselves being seduced and reduced into megaphones for the amplification of serious Trinitarian and eschatological errors , The very one who sounded the caveat on the deduction of Christianity is quickly taking its place among the seducers; The Trinity is plainly taught in God’s Word, and the Great Apostasy is not the Rapture.

More troubling still us that if this can happen to John a Mac Arthur and TBC , I am not immune.

Let Moriel, Goodfight Ministries, and Media Spotlight also take care to beware;

‘ If Possible The Elect Will Be a Deceived’.

On a personal note, for a brother like Tom Mc Mahon , whose views exactly paralleled my own on everything from Ecumenism, to Psychology, to Mel Gibson’s horrible movie , to have given Paul Wilkinson, a brother whose stand for Israel drew only my lauding sanction and promotion in Britain , the TBC conference podium as a public and internet platform to attack me as “not loving Jesus Christ” and “teaching heresy” has been a knife in the back to eclipse all of other times that I have been so stabbed.

The spectrum of those not pre Trib rank from AW Tozer and Walter Martin to David Pawson and Ray Comfort. To broadly paint all non Trib figures as Paul did at the TBC conference as being heretical and not being lovers of Christ is an outrage. Again, Dave Hunt never would have turned TBC into a public platform for propounding such a malignant and vicious eruption of slander and defamation.
It is like the Book of Kings – one generation is all that it takes to wreck havoc on the noble heritage of the previous one; one foolish son is all it takes to desecrate the legacy of the most noble of fathers.

It brings me no pleasure to think, much less to state such things. But this is what is obviously transpiring.

I have shared these convictions from a place of urgency and sincerity and not from any desire to retaliate or extract retribution for the public attacks launched on myself and others by

Tom Mc Mahon and Paul Wilkinson, two brothers whom I once would have counted as allies.

In conclusion, one thing is for absolutely certain. Irrespective of at which point we place the Resurrection and Rapture – Jesus is Indeed Coming Soon !

Thanks Al

With Much Love in Jesus,

J. Jacob Prasch

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